The Breeze With Beverage Digest
The Breeze With Beverage Digest
Episode 30: Making Sense of State SNAP Soda Bans. How Should Coke, Pepsi, and Dr Pepper Respond?
In today's Episode, Duane Stanford (Beverage Digest Editor & Publisher) and John Sicher (Industry Expert, Consultant) take a data-driven look at how new SNAP restrictions on soda and energy drinks will alter consumer behavior, retailer dynamics, and beverage brand strategy in the coming year. They weigh the policy’s equity questions, the sweetener debate, and the near-term playbook for affordability and channel shifts.
• States adopting waivers and their SNAP participation rates
• Inclusion of zero sugar and artificial sweeteners in bans
• Price inflation impact and equity concerns for low-income households
• RBC and Numerator data on cutbacks, switching, and store choice
• Channel exposure across grocery, mass, dollar, club, and convenience
• The Possible rise of private label and value packs
• Affordability tactics: smaller packages and sharper price points
• Policy test requirements and uncertain long-term outcomes
This is the breeze with Beverage Digest. I'm your host, Dwayne Stanford, the editor and publisher of Beverage Digest. The Breeze is where we bring you into the kinds of industry conversations we have every day at Beverage Digest. We dissect what's happening, connect the dots, and ask the most important question: what does this mean? I'm joined as always by my friend and co-host, John Sitcher. Many of you know him as a former editor of Beverage Digest. John has since consulted for companies ranging from Coca-Cola to Pure Circle. John, how are you doing today?
SPEAKER_00:I'm just fine, Dwayne. How are you?
SPEAKER_02:Good, man. Those are some uh exciting playoff football games, haven't they?
SPEAKER_00:Unbelievable. And you know, I guess uh we can discuss this in f with two our podcast listeners. Dwayne and I have uh many years have had uh very small bets on the NFL games of the end of the season. And last two weeks we've had uh two pushes. Uh we've each won uh one game, and uh everything now is going into the uh the Super Bowl. And uh Duane, I've got the Pats, and I think you've got the Seahawks, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. I think we just bumped up our bet just attached, didn't we? We doubled the dollars.
SPEAKER_00:I'll give our listeners a little piece of uh perhaps inside information. I'm having some back surgery in a couple of weeks, and I was over at the Orthopedic Hospital in New York City uh a couple days ago, and I was in the waiting room, and there was a guy in the waiting room with me who was very big and very fit. And I said to him, uh, sir, pardon me, let me ask you a question. Do you play ball? He said, Yes. Now, I'm not gonna disclose his name or what team he is with. He is a uh he's he he plays for an NFL team. He was injured, so he was up at this orthopedic hospital uh getting treated. And I said to him, Let me ask you a question, cone of silence. Who do you think is gonna win the Super Bowl this year out of all the teams still left in the playoffs? He hesitated not one minute and said Seattle. So that's a little bit of inside information for our listeners.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and guess who's got Seattle, baby?
SPEAKER_00:Breaks my heart, Dwayne.
SPEAKER_02:You you you grabbed the Pats pretty quick, though. You must really like that Patriots team.
SPEAKER_00:I I think the Pats are gonna are gonna do it, but boy, the Seahawks uh really fought off the the the Rams and held their own and and and held held their team together and really played a beautiful game yesterday.
SPEAKER_02:It's a darn good team, man. I tell you what, though, I just don't think I could root for the Patriots after what happened to the my Atlanta Falcons in the Super Bowl a number of years ago. Uh it'd just be a little too hard to take. So I'm glad I have Seattle.
SPEAKER_00:Well, we got two weeks. We got two weeks left, and then uh one of us is gonna have a tiny little bump to our net worth.
SPEAKER_02:That's right. All right, here we go. Well, you know, speaking of Super Bowl, obviously uh that's uh that's a big deal for beverage companies. You know, there'll be a lot of soft drinks sold, a lot of uh beer sold, and and the the thing we've decided to talk about today is the uh SNAP program, the supplemental nutrition assistance program. And this used to be referred to as food stamps. Um, this is the food assistance program for low-income families. It serves about 40 million households, and it's been uh really in the news when it comes to beverages uh in this past year. So to date, 18 states have actually been given permission by the federal government to ban the purchase of various beverages using SNAP money. Now, that turns out to be mostly soda and energy drinks, and these bands are part of the Trump administration's Make America Healthy Again agenda, which has been led by Health Secretary Robert Kennedy. Now, today what we want to do, John, is we're gonna delve into what's happening here, what's going on with these bands, and most importantly, we want to try to get a handle on what this means for the U.S. beverage industry and soda makers like Coke, PepsiCo, Curry, Dr. Pepper in the coming year or two as uh as these bans come into effect. So I I I thought we'd start off, John, if we could, with just kind of a a little quick rundown of kind of what kind of states are we talking about here. I mean, so far we're looking at about 18 states that have been granted waivers. So these are states like Indiana, Iowa, Nebraska, Utah, West Virginia, Idaho, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Colorado, Texas, Virginia, Florida, Arkansas, Tennessee, Hawaii, South Carolina, North Dakota, and Missouri. And again, most of these ban the purchase of soft drinks and energy drinks. Um you know, you can't use SNAP proceeds for those. That that doesn't mean people can't go into their other pocket, their non-SNAP funds, and buy these. Um But some of them you know say no sugary beverages, um, you know, and that's defined in various ways. Candy.
SPEAKER_00:Candy, right.
SPEAKER_02:That's right. So, you know, they're going after these kind of snack products that are obviously pretty important in Sea Stores and some of the others. But uh, you know, just what are your uh how have you been thinking about that, John, and when you when you kind of think about this going forward? And we'll kind of go into kind of what we think it means.
SPEAKER_00:You know, I think it's gonna be a problem for the soft drink companies. I mean, uh, you know, um RBC Capital Markets had a terrific research report recently. And um I know we're gonna talk more about that, but um there's a there are a lot of data points in that uh in that report which basically don't auger well for soft drinks in the year to come. Um it basically there's no doubt that um people who use people people who are beneficiaries of the SNAP program are going to cut back, some some are gonna entirely stop, some are gonna cut back on their consumption and purchases of soft drinks and energy drinks. Um and I think it's gonna be a problem. I also think, Duane, that this comes at a time where over the last few years we've seen very significant price increases on carbonated soft drinks. So I think it's gonna be a double whammy. I think that people not only are gonna be prohibited from using SNAP benefits to buy soft drinks, but it's coming in a time when there has been a year, several years of increases in soft drink prices. And I think it's I think it's gonna be a problem for the companies, and I think it's pro I actually think it's um, as we've discussed before, I happen to think it's un it's an unfair, it's it's unfair to the beneficiaries of of uh the SNAP program, um, because in many ways they're in my view, if soft drinks are safe to drink, they should be safe to drink for everybody, but they shouldn't simply be if people with lesser income should not be told that they can't buy them with one of their with parts of their currency package, so uh snap s uh uh food stamps, while people with more money are free to buy them. I just don't think that's a good government policy, but that's you know, that's the but that's probably a side issue in what you want to talk about in this podcast.
SPEAKER_02:You know, this is not just about sugar either, because most of these bands also cover soft drinks that use artificial sweeteners. So your zero sugar products, for instance, which have you know been growing. Uh the you know, the amount of zero sugar beverages that are being consumed by Americans have increased over time. Um these bands basically say you can't do sugary drinks or uh zero sugar drinks, um which is uh a a little bit surprising, but they're basically saying, I mean, uh uh what they're saying is basically they think these products are just sort of truly discretionary items that shouldn't be purchased as a staple, I guess.
SPEAKER_00:Right. I mean, I think I think that one of us or both of us should run down a few data points in this RBC capital market report.
SPEAKER_02:You know, Nick Modi actually presented that data at our conference at FutureSmarts in December, and it was really interesting data. He went through a number of kind of the big questions facing beverages right now, and that was one of those that we ask him to kind of dive into from a data perspective. And this data is really interesting. Why don't we start by looking at which states have the highest SNAP partition pr participation rates, maybe focusing on the ones over 10 percent. And there's some pretty interesting ones there.
SPEAKER_00:There there are. I mean, among the states that you mentioned, I mean, uh, for example, Florida is one of the biggest states in the Union now, 12.7 has a 12.7 percent uh participation rate in s in SNAP. Um Louisiana is 18.4 percent, Mexico is over 20 percent. So what what this means is that a very significant amount of the folks in those states participate in the SNAP program. And that and for for those people, it's gonna be h more expensive to buy soft drinks, uh at least in the near future.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, some of the states that have actually already uh you may you named a couple of them but have already banned uh you know things like soft drinks and various beverages. Louisiana, you know, again, you mentioned 18 uh.4 percent participation rate. They are one of the states that have said you can't use SNAP funds for uh certain beverages. Oklahoma, West Virginia, Florida, those are all, Hawaii, uh, you know, those are all over 10 percent, uh, and they have already pulled the trigger on on uh on these bands, South Carolina, Missouri, Texas as well. Um so those are states that you know have a pretty good participation, and they're basically saying you can't use those products for that now.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, Texas is coming on on April on April 1. They're good they're gonna re they're gonna restrict it's gonna restrict the purchase of sweetened drinks and candy according to the report. And Tex you know, so you're gonna have two of the biggest states in the country, Texas and Florida, by uh the second quarter of this year, you know, you know, banning the use of uh food stamps, I'll call them food stamps to buy beverages. And uh, you know, it's it's uh it's that's gonna have an impact, I think, on the uh on on the volume of Cocon Pepsi.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and in Texas, you mentioned Texas, so they they are banning the use of SNAP funds for sweetened drinks, and the way that's defined is five grams or more of added sugar or any amount of artificial sweetener. So they're basically saying a little bit of sugar is fine, but you can't have any artificial sweeteners. And of course, you know, there's there's a perception out there by some consumers that these products are uh you know could cause some sort of negative health effects. Um if you look at the studies, none of them are conclusive, a lot of them are associative. Uh I I don't think that question has been answered authorit, you know, firmly in terms of these things not being good for health, especially when you factor in the fact that some people do use them in order to uh help manage their weight. So, you know, that's that's an interesting question there. But states like Florida, again, we mentioned them, they they're they're banning the use of SNAP funds for soda and energy drinks. West Virginia, another high uh participation state, they're banning soda. Oklahoma, soda, and Louisiana, as we mentioned, high participation state, they're banning soda and energy. Um so, John, let's take a look at uh category spin. So one of the things that RBC did and that Nick did at our conference, and then in this uh more recent report is he looked at SNAP households versus non-SNAP house households and looking at the extent to which those households, SNAP versus non-SNAP households, buy beverages compared to the other. And uh you'll note that beverages in general uh index 117. So basically uh uh SNAP households buy beverages at a higher rate than non-SNAP households do. In soft drinks 107 index, so they buy at a higher rate, and energy drinks uh SNAP households buy at a higher rate too. Uh what do you take away from that?
SPEAKER_00:You know, I think that again, soft drinks are a very, very, very large category in supermarket sea stores. And the way the RBC report states it, it talks about aisles more dependent on SNAP households. And baby food is the highest, it's not it's not a great surprise. And then you get the next three are juices, refrigerated beverages, and carbonated soft drinks. Carbonated soft drinks index at 108. Uh, you know, it's fairly significantly uh that's uh that that that's a high index. So, you know, it's gonna be it's gonna be it's gonna be hard. It's gonna be it's gonna, as I said, I think that there's gonna be a volume hit because of the states that are doing it, and because, as I said, prices are already very high, so it's gonna be difficult for lower-income households that can't use SNAP benefits to buy soft drinks. Affordability is gonna be a real issue for these lower income households. And um, you know, I I think we're probably not gonna see the impact in the in the data for till toward the middle of the year, but I think it certainly it certainly makes it it it puts a premium in importance for the software companies to fit to figure out some affordability uh tactics in order to basically not leave these folks out of the software franchise.
SPEAKER_02:Trevor Burrus Especially if they are going to potentially shift from the Snap pocket to their just normal household income pocket. And you know, they're gonna be more price sensitive with that money potentially, but if you want to keep them in your categories and yeah, some of that affordability in those states, there's gonna have to be some sort of uh strategies for those states, you would think. You know, with Yeah, go ahead. Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_00:I think I think Coke using smaller packages and C stores, which is gonna bring the price per package down. You know, I think that we're gonna see a lot of that this year.
SPEAKER_02:Um and uh For many, for just general affordability. Exactly.
SPEAKER_00:Exactly.
SPEAKER_02:You know, uh John, one of the things is this this cuts right to this whole debate about carbonated soft drinks in general and the notion of are these staples? I mean, I guess what you know, people who want these bands are arguing that this is not a staple. You shouldn't use SNAP funds, you know, as you know, the the same money that you buy baby food with, you shouldn't use it to buy carbonated soft drinks. So they're making a value judgment about those products. And on the other side, you might say, well, these are you know discretionary, are they staples or are they discretionary? Are they uh an affordable luxury? Like and then you get to the question which you've kind of raised a bit too, is like, okay, a SNAP recipient, do they have um do they have autonomy to decide where they want to buy something on a s discretionary or an affordable luxury basis versus a staple basis? Are these products like so meaningless that uh you know SNAP recipients shouldn't be allowed to consume them and enjoy them, especially you know, when there's uh in moderation, all of these products it's pretty clear are are safe, uh especially compared to a lot of other things that you know people consume. Uh it see this whole thing seems to cut right to that broader debate about carbonated soft drinks in general that we've been having for you know 20 or 30 years, no?
SPEAKER_00:Look, I think you know, I followed the soft drink industry, the beverage industry for a long, long time. And um, you know, there's been debate for many, many years about the impact of soft drinks on obesity, on diabetes, the safety of artificial sweeteners. My view is I've that soft drinks are absolutely fine, consumed in moderation. They are a they go well with food, uh they provide moments of pleasure during the day, they provide hydration, they provide fun uh during and during you know parties and entertainment. And again, I am personally think that I personally think that um telling people with lower income, lower income households, that they should not consume these, or that they're whether the government's providing a negative deterrent to those folks to consume these, while for the rest of people who can afford it, uh you know, the message is go ahead if you want to. I just think that's not good government policy. Um but nonetheless, that's where we are, and um that's what the software that's what the soft drink companies are facing this year. And they're gonna have to basically figure out some way not to leave loyal customers in lower income house and lower income households behind. And the only way to do that is through coming up with affordability tactics and strategies, affordability packages. Uh there, you know, I don't see prices being rolled back on a on a sort of EQ case basis, but the but the affordability this year is going to be more important than ever, I think.
SPEAKER_02:This episode of The Breeze is brought to you by Ball Corporation, the leading provider of aluminum beverage packaging. As a longtime partner of the beverage industry, Ball helps brands of all sizes navigate change, manage challenges, and unlock growth through reliable supply, strong relationships, and purposeful innovation. From specialty sizes to advanced finishes and graphics, Ball works closely with customers to bring their brands to life and help them stay ahead of evolving consumer demand. Learn more at Ball.com. You know, another thing that occurs to me is there's a bit of a value judgment here when it comes to energy drinks because energy drinks, you know, there's uh increasing numbers of consumers that use energy drinks uh for their morning caffeine hit. Uh some have replaced coffee with energy drinks. There's some evidence of that. Um but with snap benefits in these states, you can buy coffee if you want. Um and so there there's almost a value judgment being made about what sort of caffeine you use in the morning. And you know, energy drinks clearly a number of states have said, look, these things we don't believe that they're something that people need, but coffee's fine. Um you know, I think on a very knee-jerk surface basis, you can kind of see why people draw that conclusion. But if you really dig into it, uh energy drinks don't have any more uh caffeine than coffee. Um they mostly all the the growth in the new products are all zero sugar now, so you don't really have um, you know, the the issue of sh mixing sugar and Caffeine as much as you might have in the past. So again, it's a sort of a value judgment on where you get your caffeine. And I would imagine also a big part of the energy drink factor here for the SNAP, for these snap bands, is the fact that all these zero products, zero sugar products use artificial sweeteners. So clearly, a lot of what we're seeing here has to do with artificial sweeteners as much as sugar, as we saw with the recent dietary guidelines, where they're basically taking aim at artificial sweeteners in addition to sugar.
SPEAKER_00:You raise a good point. I mean, I think very few people um walk out of a Starbucks or a diner with a cup of coffee without any kind of sweetener in it. I don't have data on that, but I imagine most people are putting either a packet of sugar or a packet of aspartame or a packet of sucralose in their coffee to sweeten it. So you raise a good point. There's but for some reason coffee basically sailed through uh and carbonated soft drinks and energy drinks did not. Again, I covered the industry for many years. I don't want to sound like uh a raw-raw router for the industry, because I've always tried to cover it as you have, Duane, objectively. But this to me is just not good policy, this restriction of uh the restriction on the use of SNAP benefits for soft drinks and energy drinks.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so now the big question is, okay, what are consumers going to do? And we asked uh uh Nick to kind of take a look at the data at FutureSmarts and kind of give us a sense of what do we think consumers are going to do. And he did some research. He worked with Numerator uh to do some research on what SNAP households actually buy with SNAP benefits. And so uh a household that buys beverages is defined as you know making at least 12 trips with SNAP funds uh used as payment. So these are people that are actually, you know, meaningfully spending uh SNAP proceeds for these kind of products. And the question was, what are they gonna do? Um are they going to continue to buy these products or not? And 70 percent said they would scale back in some point. Are you surprised by that at all, John?
SPEAKER_00:I'm not. I'm not. I mean, if you I mean if if you break down the data, you know, some people say they'll stop buying completely, about 11, 11, 12, 11, 12 percent. 30 to 40 percent saying they'll sp they'll spend significantly less. As you said, 70 percent of SNAP recipients basically will stop buying or buy less. Uh not many people say there'll be no change in their purchase habits. So, as I said, if 70 percent of Snap uh of SNAP consumers, SNAP household consumers, are gonna stop buying or buy less, pretty big number and potentially pretty big impact ahead.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that's like uh so when it comes to soft drinks and soda, if you look at the people who are gonna completely stop, it's 11% of people will completely stop buying soda, 13% will stop buying energy drinks. When you match that with significantly less, now you're talking about 43%, almost 44% of people will stop buying soft drinks and soda, and another 47%, almost half, will either stop buying or buy significantly less. Those are kind of the scary numbers in those states for the beverage companies.
SPEAKER_00:They are. And you know, um Nick also had some interesting data on what cons what SNAP consumers would do. And um the question was, how likely would it would you how likely would you be to shift to retailers with the lowest price? Well, guess what? Very few said it would only be unlikely, uh, eight or nine percent. Forty forty percent say they would very likely shift to retailers with the lowest price. So I think it's gonna have an impact on the beverage industry. I suspect that it's gonna have an impact on retailers because soft drinks are very important for retailers. Um retailers will benefit will relatively benefit. Um I suspect that we're gonna see a bump next year in private label, which sells at a substantial discount from the big branded beverages from Coke Pepsi and Dr. Pepper, because there are going to be certain people certain SNAP households, I think, Dwayne, who if they can't use food stamps or they can't use SNAP benefits, but they want to keep drinking soda, they'll look for products and channels where it's l where it's less pricey. And private label, I think, is going to benefit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So you're you'll uh I mean, at least according to this data, it is a strong indication that you are gonna see some channel shifting, um, which you know brings up the point, okay, where are SNAP recipients buying these energy drinks and and soft drinks? Trevor Burrus, Jr. You know, RBC also looked at uh where SNAP recipients are making their purchases. Like where what channels are they using to buy uh groceries with SNAP benefits? And we see that the you know food channel grocery stores are about 39 percent of Snap trips. Uh Mass retailers like Walmart are about 26 percent of Snap trips. Gas and convenience get about a fifth. You know, they get about a fifth of all Snap uh trips are at gas and convenience stores. You know, that of course that's where you're gonna be uh consuming energy drinks and soft drinks as well. Uh and then you you look at dollar, club, uh, you know, those more discount channels, it's it's 10% and 4% for club. Dollar at 10 percent at 9 percent, club at 4 percent, drug stores 1.3. So uh you know that numerated data is suggesting uh that some of that is going to shift away from food and mass towards your dollar and ca and club. Maybe not mass, because you know, as long as that's stores like Walmart, uh, you know, though they should retain some of that. But what does that mean for gas and convenience at a time when you know prices for some of these uh for soft drinks and energy drinks are going up? Um, you know, people are more strapped, so perhaps they're not, when they fill up their tank, they're not going into the store as often. Uh what's that gonna mean for that channel? That's that's a question here as well.
SPEAKER_00:So it's a problem. And also remember, as we've we as we've discussed on many podcasts, that that uh media consumption channel is the most profitable for the soft drink companies. To the extent that uh there's a cutback on buying soft drinks and energy drinks uh in sea stores, it's gonna it's gonna be a problem. And uh again, I've repeat I I've said this a couple of times, affordability this year is gonna be so important. And uh it's gonna be interesting to watch uh what happens with pricing, what happens with new packages, uh, and um because they they cannot leave these consumers behind. They cannot abandon these consumers, uh who are who many of whom have been loyal consumers of energy drinks and soft drinks for years. They can they cannot abandon them because of this um this change in the SNAP program.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, uh and on that point, John, uh RBC also found that 60 percent of Snap buyers say they would shift their spending to essential grocery categories. So if they can't use Snap f you know, if they can't use Snap dollars uh you know to buy soft drinks or energy drinks, what would they shift those dollars to? And sixty percent of them say essential groceries, so produce, bread, meat, that kind of thing. So you know, another indication of you know these consumers are you know strapped in general, and so uh they're gonna shift those dollars to other things as opposed to um you know going ahead and foregoing some of that and still, you know, getting their energy drink morning caffeine dose.
SPEAKER_00:That's right. So, you know, I mean I guess that's what RFK Jr. and uh uh wanted to see. And um, you know, if you can't buy soft drinks, uh the they they're gonna shift purchases to produce, bread, meat, etc. And that's that's fine. But again, it's I just don't think it's good government policy to basically be that paternalistic and uh basically tell one demographic group in our country what they can and can't buy uh and r not have any kind of restriction or discouragement for the for um folks who uh are fortunate enough to have uh higher income levels.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so Kevin Keene is the uh president and CEO of the American Beverage uh Association, American Beverage, uh and that's the you know the chief trade association for the non-alcoholic beverage industry in the U.S. that represent companies like Coke, Pepsi, and uh Curry, Dr. Pepper. And I asked him, okay, so what do you what is the industry doing now when it comes to these SNAP bans? You've got 18 states that have have uh you know put some sort of uh asked for a waiver and been granted a waiver. Uh you got more states that are likely to come. This will be kind of rolled out over through uh through this year. Most of those states will come on all the way in through October. Uh again, more could come. What are they doing? And and and his answer just in sum is you know, look, this is they're not gonna spend a lot of effort trying to fight these uh waivers necessarily. I mean, these are what the states want to do. They don't have any problem with the question of what should um governments spend resources on, uh, you know, sh what kinds of groceries should they spend resources on for the for uh you know those who need these benefits? You know, they're saying that that's that's a perfectly reasonable question, but they do take issue with the fact that you would single out one product over other products. And but you know, the train is barreling down the track. So you're not gonna do much to stop this momentum right now. But there is a second part of this, as they point out, and that's that these states are in essence, these waivers are really, these bands are really test projects. And these tests have to be followed up with some sort of proof that they're achieving the objectives that are laid out for the waiver. So whether that's cutting sugar consumption or cutting health care costs uh to the state uh because you're reducing certain uh diseases, uh they've got to come back and and show that these, in essence, pilot projects actually work. So I think the industry is waiting to they believe that they're not gonna be able to show the kind of results, especially in a situation where beverage calories have been steadily decreasing for years now and obesity rates continue to escalate. So they make the case that there must be other factors at work as well. Uh so they think that that this is not gonna be something that those states can show and that that may uh have a real impact on whether these kinds of bans continue on long term.
SPEAKER_00:You know, you know, my my uh my only issue with that is that those kinds of studies, you know, showing an impact on health uh are measured over many years, sometimes even decades. And um, you know, I don't know how I don't know how quickly the industry is going to be able to basically take advantage of that. But you know, I I think I think you know the industry short term has to, as you as you implied, Gwen, the industry short term has to basically take the cards it's been dealt with. That my guess is that these um limitations on use of SNAP benefits are going to be around for at least a couple of years and begin to very quickly adopt strategies and tactics that enable folks with lower income to still buy the moments of pleasure, moments of enjoyment, the soft ranks that they've enjoyed for many, many years. Uh, I I think that I look forward to reading in Beverage Digest over the next year or two what the soft rank companies are doing to do that, because I think it's going to be very interesting to watch.
SPEAKER_02:We're definitely going to be watching it closely. In fact, our next issue, we'll delve into this data, we'll delve into the RBC report, we'll delve into what Nick discussed at FutureSmarts, uh, continue to get a handle on this issue, which is, you know, obviously very important for the industry and you know, quite frankly, fascinating right now as well. So look for that in our our next issue. But John, that's a good place to leave it, I think. Thank you as always for uh digging into that with me. And uh hey, go Seattle.
SPEAKER_00:Um I think I can respond to that Wayne.
SPEAKER_02:Hi, John. Thanks giving. We'll see what happens.
SPEAKER_00:Good to be with you. Talk to you soon.
SPEAKER_01:The breeze is produced by Beverage Digest. Visit our website to learn more about our products and subscribe to our newsletter. That's www.beverage digest.com.